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I was keeping my distance and ignoring the piss out of that guy, but if anything he threw struck myself, or anyone nearby(this guy was an awful fucking shot), he would've received a wedgie so painful, his Grannie would'a been shrieking in terror!!!!
This was at, or beyond the front of the pack led by Drooby and Matt.
A couple of butt-buddies in a white Mercedes decided to start plowing into the path of us, and the passenger/"shitty-excuse-for-a-door-gunner", decided to speak his piece.
He then decided to stay with the ride for about 1-3 miles and proceeded to scream like a ho, and throw shit out of his car like a whiny, little child.
He was acting all high and mighty with all of us around, but I'd sure like to see him pull that with LE.
They'd have him on the ground screaming like a little, kitteh and begging for his mommy to come pick him up.
No son, you need to be tossed into lock-up with some real, gang-bangers.
Not the wiggers and preppy-thugs you go to private-school with.
There were a number of incidents during the ride down Hollywood Blvd at about 10:45-11:00pm.
First was the guys in the white Mercedes who rode down the wrong side of the road to pass up the pack of bicycles. Then they turned back and start to taunt the group. It was funny, as we approached them at the stop light at Western and Hollywood, how they completely went from the left hand turn lane to the right lane and escaped. In the end, though they may have acted like fools at first, they ran like cowards when the pack was closing in on them.
Some people on the Hollywood and Highland sidewalk threw stuff at the people on the bikes as they were passing by. Seems that the bad economy has made people angry this holiday season.
@Tarmonster....Im that one asshole who gets outta line and speaks outta turn when i get too shit faced...but ive been working on it...Ill say wassup...Im an okay guy.... when im not a drunk piece of shit, that is..
but, aren't we all..?
I thought that last nights LACM was maybe the best LACM ive been to this whole year, and I didnt miss one this whole year. We rode, the stops were about 10mins long and we RODE! I thought the speed was perfect. I didnt hear about any bad crashes for run-in with the cops. Best LACM of this year!
The ride WAS great. It was a good long route and the stops were short. Thanks to everyone who picked up their trash and to those who picked up other people's trash.
Bogie's Liquor also wants to thank the ride for stopping at their place, it made their Christmas in this down economy.
@monster....Im Steve and we have met....youll get a kick outta us meeting....watch youll be like "awwww!!! Fo real? nawww!!!"
im telling you....you give me less attitude on the forum than in person....i like this...the whole "anonymous-till-formally-introduced"
part of it all.....N e ways were okay..(mas-o-menos sighns w/hand)
@tarmonster - steve is the asshole at junu's who wouldnt stop blowing into the empty bottle of beer, passed out on the couch. i stole his spot from the kitchen counter when he got up to take a dump. then we kicked him out
i love you steve
Eddie, for sure I can't make the punk playlist. my ipod is formatted for mac and all the punk music i have is on my brothers windows comp. not even sure if imma go on the ride (might be heading to medieval times - family stuff)
Annie I do agree with you on most of your points, this ride HAS turned into a feeder for the People's ride, although a giant mob of Ridazz in LA from 7pm to Midnite or whenever is not necessarily a bad thing. Yes the routes are definitely predictable or traditional or whatever. I think if they just kept some parts of the same routes, it would still cause the car-bike alertness the Ride is supposed to create, but cracking some new territory is in order. I think LA deserves leaders for its Critical Mass rides, you're talking about riding in LA, on a Friday night. What a time slot and location for a bike ride! The Ridazz deserve capable direction and cool routes. Fuck now there's like three rides I want to lead
I was taking pictures, and no one was incriminated. No worries. They're at my blog at http://bikexdatabase.com/blog. I missed the guy in the white mercedes, but if you get shit on a ride GET THE LICENSE PLATE! and send it to me at the database. I have a plan for these jerks. I thought it was a great ride; yeah, a little fast for a mass at times, but hey, thats healthy.
oh fuck off....when i arrived to lacm, i immediately was TOLD what the route was going to be...that person was at the front of the ride the whole time....i said a few times to this person "why are we stopping at a liquor store?" i was told something along the lines that WE JUST ARE....and i kept asking the question, and was told again IT'S JUST ONE STOP...i'm not one for controversy......i'll tell you why i stayed after bogies a bit.....to talk to friends....i was chatting with Sonny, Ryan, his girlfriend, and tallcans alex.....i even expressed to you at bogies how lame it was to stop there....your answer was (and don't deny this) "if you were drunk you'd probably enjoy it more"....u douche.... :)
Fuck that shit.....like annie said, just a few hours a month....ride the streets.....you obviously don't grasp what critical mass is all about...you're one of my good friends on rides....but you're totally wrong on this one....
and ....i'm not leading shit.....just trying to gather a few people that wanna do a critical mass ride the way it's supposed to be done...we'll probably leave at 7pm sharp to get a few good hours in of RIDING...read above....leaderless, routeless, no beer stops....do whatever you want that night....i'll be in front of the wiltern with the ones that wanna ride that night....
I wasn't there cause I had to pick up a MTB in Santa Monica.
Not bad for $220 huh? That's with a Easton and a Titec handlebars upgrade. Less than a year old too! Salton Sea here I come!
Anyways back to resurrecting LACM. This ride always gets fucked up when we have a leader. Having people like Brad and Annie saying you guys got your head up your ass is NOT LEADING.
I'm all for getting an alternative going of LACM. But I don't think we need to be across the street. We'll just start it right there where it always starts. We'll just pass it on to what we're doing. The guys in with megaphones that want to take it to the liquor store can take off before we leave. We'll just roll after like we have done in the pass. With no leaders, no directions, and no plans other than to ride till we quit.
BTW, my plans yesterday were to talk people into going to Beverly Hills. I'll do that next month and It'll be a group decision.
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
DO WHAT YOU WANT
do what we want
Take it or leave it these rides have become social rides for the most part and it doesnt bother me. We make our presence known each and every day on a multitude of DAILY not just Monthly rides. We dont really need a real CM to make our presence known in Los Angeles.
For just a few hours each month, you can put down the pipe and beer and ride a bike....think you can handle that?
Here's the basic description on wikipedia.
Critical Mass bike rides take place monthly in cities around the world. They are free mass participatory events, with no leaders or fixed agendas. However, the broad aim is to celebrate cycling and sustainable transport, and to give cyclists safety in numbers.
Barleye, I don't think you need to be so offended by the drinking...it's obviously popular among the riders that ride critical mass, or it wouldn't be so accepted. Understand, a community develops based on the choices of the group - and this group is overall deciding to stop and have some beers. It's not like we're killing children. When I get antsy I just get on my bike and ride around a bit until everyone is ready to go. Maybe you could do that? Or, you could whine until it changes?
Although, I do agree critical mass should be leaderless. Que sera sera.
I'm not offended by anyone drinking....I don't even think i'm whining about anything.....what's your solution? just keep my mouth shut and do whatever happens? I can't do that re: c.m.
Like what a few others said....the LACM used to be an awesome ride that rode the whole time and didn't stop and it put a point across even if it's only in our own minds..we're not gonna change the world on any bike rides but at least we can know that we did the best we could by riding the last friday of the month as cyclists do on every continent and probably every state in the u.s.
like Matt said, we're making a huge presence on the streets of l.a. daily....i totally agree with that.....but i disagree with his point that we don't really need a c.m. in l.a. cuz of our daily presence....
we're not making any point sitting in a parking lot doing whatever we do there....
go ahead, voice your opinion. You certainly have a right to. But I'm just saying that it's more likely that everyone will continue to do what they want. ie., Ride, stop, drink, smoke, talk, none of the above....everyone will exercise their choices. And if that results in the majority of riders on CM stopping, then that's what happens.
By the way...maybe what we accomplish by sitting in a lot, hanging out, enjoying each other's company is that A) We have a good time, and B) Others get to see that it's possible to have a good time without having to be in a designated "recreational area," like a bar, club, etc. Maybe we expand their thinking just a little bit. Or maybe they just think we're a bunch of crazy hippie weirdos. Eh?
I defently think it should not be a predictable route. and maybe if the ride ends up to far from the peoples ride we could make phone contact and both could ride to an equal meet up point that way we could meet up with out having to go all the way back to fat burger.
EDDIE NOT EVERYONE LIKES TO SUCK A BIG FAT DICK. SPEAKING OF SUCKING BIG FAT DICKS, I KNOW YOU GOT A BF!! WHAT DID I TELL YOU ABOUT HAVING A BF WHEN YOU'RE WORKING FOR ME???? NO BFS WITHOUT MY OK, REMEMBER? ONE PSYCHO BF CAN FUCK UP MY WHOLE OPERATION!! SO GET RID OF THE BF OR YOU AIN'T WORKING FOR ME!!!
I call BS on ridazz wanting to make a b-line to Louie's Liquor store!!! Can I have a show of hands of people that wanted to go to a liquor store after riding 5 miles?
I'm not against drinking on the ride. Hell just about every LACM I roll to I have beers to hand out. That doesn't mean I want to roll to a liquor store when we hit the road though. What's wrong with going across the street before the ride and getting a beer? What's wrong with riding 15 miles randomly before we even start to think about stopping? What's wrong with you guys that always get to the front to lead, let others take the lead for once? People aren't stupid, they see the people that lead this thing each month. It's become a ride with leaders!!!!
Your idea was suggested long ago. So far the people that do the second ride aren't too receptive to this idea. Given the options, I like the idea of starting a second LACM and get back to what it was. And that is leaderless, wonder in no particular direction, and with no goals in mind. You'd be surprised how fun that is!
There was people that want to fuck shit up before this, and there will be people that want to fuck things up after this. It doesn't mean all the sudden we need leaders.
You have leaders on the second ride, and shit goes fucked up. Examples; There was some dude trying to walk out yesterday with beer and shit before the ride. The security was there trying to confront this dude. There were no leaders there to resolve the situation. Example 2; we hang out at the Rite-Aid for 45 min to an hour on the second ride, then roll less than 4 miles to a Ralph's store to get beer. Again this is with leaders. So there's a falasy in believing that leaders are the solution.
This argument should be a reminder to everybody why the Core Elite is Core Elite.
Listen to the wisdom of the elders
Core Elite members have been around since the beginning of LACM. .
Critical Mass is suppose to be leaderless and unpredictable.
Its like a slam pit, you don't know what is going to happen but if you let yourself get caught in the whirlwind you know you are going to have fun. Let loose and go with the flow.
No leaders. No routes. Should never be the same ride twice.
Follow that and it will always turn out FUN
USER1 can be a real pain the ass at times but listen to him on this one. He has been doing CM before many of you even thought about getting out on a bike when you where in Jr. High or earlier.
It's strange and hypocritical that someone is complaining that the rules aren't being followed for a ride where there aren't suppose to be rules.
A small discontent few seem to want to push their views and their ideals upon the 250 riders who are perfectly happy about the way things have been going. It's that kind of Fascist?
If you want to participate in the route process get in the front, talk to those who are leading the ride. Instead of being immature and throwing bombs, whining or hijacking try dialogue instead. You know dialogue, it's what adults do.
By the way Laissez-faire in French means, "let do" or "allow to do". When you want go against what the majority of the people are doing you are anti-Laissez-faire.
And screw the Core Elite and the old way. Change has come to America and LACM!
Yeah stopping within 30 minutes seems rather lame to me. Buy your beer before you go! We're standing around hanging out for 30 minutes to an hour before the ride starts anyway. If you're late you have a cell phone and a friend. And the pack moves slowly anyway. Ride to the front, see a liquor store, hop off your bike, buy your beer, and rejoin the pack. Is it that hard? You want to talk with your friends? Isn't that why the pack moves so slowly? Ride safely and talk with your friends! Its a social ride! Stopping and hanging out in liquor store parking lots isn't that new of an idea. I went to get some churros at my local panaderia, and there were a bunch of guys standing around drinking beer. I don't want to be them.
annie and barleye are right.just about every other ride on MRis a party ride so why cant we have something different?
another thing,make sure your bike is working properly before you come to the ride.making 400 people wait an hour after the start time so you can fix a flat that you had a month to get straight =weaksauce
look at how the people in other citys do it ,SF,NYC, hell my mom goes on the ride in atlanta and it gets 1000 riders.
i am proud to be born and raised in los angeles.however,our "LACM" is an embarrasing joke.
spoke cards?= fail
and yes this goes out to you fuzzbeast. there somebody said it.
the peoples ride is part of the probelem.now all the critical mass does is bring around hollywood until the start of that ride.
if you want peoples ride to be something quit hijacking CM.
i thought peoples was a cool down/ late night after ride
CM is now the warm up in some peoples mind.
get a fucking clue people!!!!!!!!critical mass is the reason things like midnight ridazz exists.is is the granddaddy of all "alternative bike culture".show some respect and know your history.
LACM is a joke.................
yeah it was one of those colder nights in december i believe. we took the long ways around and saw all the lights and even went as far as the beverly center.
but we kept riding. we kept riding mainly cause it was EFFING cold, but we kept riding. this whole stop thing is complete shit to me, if you want to drink, tow a trailer with a keg on it and attach a straw.
half the time is spent chillin, not riding, and for rides that draw the numbers that these rides do, you're asking for some sort of bottleneck effect.
when i talk to random people who ride their bikes around l.a., they mention how immature and annoying the MR forums have become; and now i understand which individuals are creating that atmosphere.
but to return to the topic and reminisce a bit, i remember several summers ago where critical mass went to some taco stands in downtown, then to an street party in downtown and a couple gallery parties. that was so awesome! we all ended up spending about seven hours together not knowing what was going to happen. i think one person mentioned the street party and we were all excited to check it out.
i find it incredibly sad that people are arguing against having ONE ride a month that is a generally leaderless.
now the retards can commence posting emotionally reactionary comments that are irrelevant to the LACM topic. please, be my guest. your comments make me want to masturbate.
....you made that months c.m. ride what it was supposed to be....next month we can all do the same thing....take it in unpredictable directions....it's done in over 100 cities across the world...most on the same day.....i posted it up to leave at 7pm instead of 7:30....most cities leave at 5:30 when the most traffic is on the road....that would be the ideal time..maybe one of these months we can try it...everyone can ask a month ahead of time for a few hours off work that day... if people are running late they can call someone and hook up with us wherever we are.
Leave my girl out this! She's enjoying her new bf and I'm pissed she didn't tell me.
Are you kidding me? 250 ridazz on the LACM ride? Yeah maybe on a good day in the middle of the summer, but certainly not the last three rides. We are proposing something with far less rules and leadership, a voice for all, with a flare for not knowing what's coming up next. What are you guys offering? A five mile ride to the liquor store, kill a little time on the road, then roll to the second ride. whoop di do!!!
The core elite exist in your head, nothing more, nothing less.
@ Bo Bo
What am I, chop liver?!?!
Do some research on what CM is. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_Mass
It's a voice for everyone. Everyone has a vote. No one has more control than another. The ones voicing their disapproval on this thread do so cause it's one of their favorite rides. They want it back. The feeling for the unknown in this ride is addictive. Granted sometimes it doesn't pan out. But when it does, it's one of the most magical nights!
Others get to see that it's possible to have a good time without having to be in a designated "recreational area," like a bar, club, etc. Maybe we expand their thinking just a little bit. Or maybe they just think we're a bunch of crazy hippie weirdos. Eh?
Yes, we're truly shattering the leisure-time entertainment paradigm by standing around in parking lots drinking cheap beer like a bunch of optionless teenagers in a depressed Midwestern town. I can't wait to see what the next product of several hundred people's combined imagination and creativity will be. Maybe standing around in our own driveways drinking cheap beer like Hank Hill and his friends?
@ANNIE AND BARLEYE you are totally right .nobody gets it,thanks for being real and truthfull.
a steady diet of the same old shit get boring.i am hungry for one of my favorite rides.
@ big gay al........sorry man i still love you,forgive me?
OK FUCK THIS BULLSHIT!
Sorry, I'm a bit tiffed.
Yeah, blame me.
Sure It's ALLL MY FAULT CM is what it is.
I don't care where CM goes. I really dont. I'm not planning anything, Neither are the other 10 people who were tossing ideas around trying to figure out somewhere to go. Instead of just naysaying ideas, here's one, try and contribute something rather than just saying "let's not do that". If you're going to try to improve the ride, contribute, rather than bitching, and I mean do it on the ride, all of you know at least someone who was/is/am/are/were/whatever is riding herd on the ride, it's called yourself.
Do you think I like riding around midtown and hollywood almsot every month? well, the answer is not really, it gets kinda boring.
Wanna do something constructive?
Get to the front of the ride and take it somewhere else. Don't just say "Let's not go to the liquor store" actually TAKE THE FUCKING RIDE SOMEWERE.
If you guys REALLY don't wanna stop, fine, I'm not saying CM has to stop. I never did. I never MADE YOU stop. you who wanna keep riding, fine, next CM if the ride stops, Make noise, say NO, Get others to follow, Encourage people to say something. Better yet, do it BEFORE THE STOP. Me, Drooby, SKD, Stillline, and whoever else didn't make a route, other than an idea of somewhere to go. We made it up as we went. Same as it goes every month.
Get people to follow you, it's pretty fucking easy.
I will say though, not having stops is going to make large numbers of the ride's participants grumble, and probably leave. Also, part of the reason LACM evolved into the way it is (i.e. coming up with a destination in mind) rather than the way it is in other cities is the fact that LA is FUCKING MASSIVE. Stops not only give people a chance to get whatever refreshments they want ( I bought a donut!) it also give individuals, groups, even other rides a chance to meet up with the ride.
You know, those people who you didn't see at the start that sometimes show up at the stops, yeah, many of those are your friends too, why not have stops and let people catch up?
Or when a group gets split off, due to traffic or something, it gives them a chance to catch back up. if people have an idea as to where the group might be going, it sure as hell makes it easier to find us.
LA is 432 sq miles, just the city itself, it's not like SF or any other city. If a groups gets split off, the odds of them reconnecting at random are pretty slim. Unlike Sf were the city is 7x7, and if a splinter goes off, the hit again pretty soon. Why should we do CM the same way everyone else does, Our city, our CM.
OK, and as to having a megaphone, yeah, I did, I had it because I was going to the Funderstorm later that night. I wasn't the only one with a mega phone either.
Also, if you're gonna call someone out on something, weather it's even their fault of not, please just come out and say it, to the person you're talking about/to. Stop with the passive/agressiveness. And yes, I'm talking to you Annie. I'd like to thank robert for at least having the guts to give the person who he was complaining about a name, even if I had nothing to do with spoke cards (which DIDN"T even say LACM on them (go look, they're for the people's ride only), the route was a question posed to pretty much a whole shitload of people, and well, waiting 5 whole minutes for a tube to be changed at the start of the ride, I was trying to get people to leave when I heard several people telling me to wait as we had a mechanical. so I stopped telling people to go. cause you know, the 5 minutes it takes to change a flat is going to kill people. Seriously. Chill out.
I just have a few things to contribute to this... i asked you, fuzz, a legit question at the very start to you about why we have to stop at bogeysl......you flat out said we had to, or we were going to....no questions asked...you werenít going to change your mind as you set yourself as the proclaimed leader Friday night..not to get in anynoes face, but who are you, drooby, matt, stuart, or anyone else for that matter to make ANY calls on where to stop on any c.m? like you said, get the to the front and make a call....you can say all you want, but that simply wouldn't work with you in front...Drooby stayed about 30-40 feet in front of everyone for most of the time anyways.....a newbie isn't gonna say anything.....and even someone like me who's ridden with you guys for a few years......well, it's just a bit overwhelming and confrontational and at that point you just sorta go with the flow......I coulda bailed at bogeys but stayed around to chat with Sonny.....i left at the top of vermont when I heard you guys were going to Griffith parkÖ.the ride is supposed to stay on well traveled streets with cars since itís a critical mass ride..
it comes to this....there shouldn't have been a route, a major suggestion by me to you Fuzz was made at the very beginning about not stopping...then you asked me a few blocks into the ride where bogey's was and i wouldn't tell you cuz i reiterated that we shouldn't stop for liquor on a c.m. ride....i did a few minutes later cuz i consider you a friend....i don't let this shit ruin friendships, i just got proactive and posted up the ride earlier next month with the c.m. ideals for all to read.
don't be pissed at me for saying my peace.....and i don't call people out on a board for shit like this....i'm a little older and have been taught to treat others like i'd like to be treated....i live my life that way....
@fuzzbeast: i wasn't being passive aggressive. i thought i had a reputation for being the aggressive/confrontational one, but apparently i'm not living up to those expectations.
in the past, i have hurt people's feelings for 'calling them out', so i decided to try a different approach. obviously, you like the traditional aggressive me better, and i'll remember that in the future. my sincerest apologies for allowing those who were being selfish or 'leading' the ride to step forward THEMSELVES, and discuss it.
like i previously mentioned, i attempted to discuss this issue of a planned route with one of the 'organizers' IN PERSON and they did not like it. i suppose i brought it up in hopes that they would realize this: "oh hey, i didn't even realize that i liked this ride so much that i started to take it over. sure, let's let critical mass be. i'll step aside."
i am not here to give you shit and in fact i like you .when i have talked with you on rides you are a positive guy.
i am trying to make a point about what critical mass is and unfoturnately, what it has become.
I never said CM has to stop. I said that we had decided to stop. At that point you, and whoever else wanted to do something else had PLENTY of time (at that point, like 7 or 8 miles) to take the ride somewhere else.
If you can get a couple together to take the ride somewhere, really at any point do it. We ended up going to Bogeys, because well, to be honest a group of us got together, at the beginning, trying to come up with somewhere to ride, Someone in the group of people near us said scientology, so we went there, someone else said bogeys, so we went there. Like I said, the only reason any sort of route is come up with at all is because of the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. Unfortunately, when a ride gets to a certain size, it takes several people to get it to go ANYWHERE.
I've been doing CMs off and on for at least 10 years, in several cities across this country, and seriously, EVERY city has their own way of doing CM. I've seen some that are huge meandering masses of cyclists turning at will, fracturing and reforming, usually with some sort of geological boundary. I've seen CM's with police escorts along a permitted parade/march route. I've seen hilly as fuck CM's (Even in *GASP* San Francisco that mythical city that does Cm "right" because they invented it). I've seen CM's that are filled with costumes, others that really do look like a mass of commuters. CM is done differently in EVERY city, and there is no "right way" to do it, they're all CM. So a method of doing it one way has evolved in LA, cool.
None of us proclaimed ourselves 'leaders', we were just one vocal group. You want the ride to do something else, STEP UP and do it, get people together and do so. Don't just talk about it. We had one idea,
Barleye, I'm not mad at anyone. I was a bit upset at the underhanded, passive aggressive tone being taken in some of the early posts in this thread, that was most of it. On friday, when you asked me, I may have bristled at you a bit, but it was more to do with the fact that you came at me with an attitude of "I'm not going to help because I don't agree" when I asked you a simple question, and then continuing in that manner, rather than trying to provide an alternative solution. I thanked you then and am thanking you now for telling me later on that night. I didn't really need to know, when I asked you, in regards to finding it, it was more of an honest question because i was curious.
I know you want to just ride all night on CM, and that's cool, but let me share some of the experience I've had with CM's that do that. Everyone has fun, and the ride goes fine, for about 10 miles, then it starts to dwindle, FAST. It's over by 8-8:30 or so if it starts at 6. People get tired, they get thirsty (and not just for alcohol, I know i drink at least 2 bottles of water on any ride), they get hungry, have to pee, or they just want a break, whatever.
Having stops helps keep the ride going longer, it slows the attrition rate. Sure some of the stops could probably be spread out, if CM doesnt meet up with the people's ride, which was originally created, if I remember correctly, to allow people that work farther or later, or whatever to be able to join the ride more easily, which is why a ride started up later in the night after CM starts in the first place.
Isn't Critical Mass about riding into traffic. "We are traffic!" Isn't that the whole idea of the ride? I thought we did that effectively on Friday night. The route, the leaders and all this other stuff is just semantics.
Shouldn't the ride be about a large mass of bicycles taking over the streets from the cars? If we breakup the group or ride through desolate streets in downtown LA, doesn't that defeat the purpose? It also becomes just like any other Midnight Ridazz ride.
I don't know what the solution to this drama is, but I think we are losing sight of the true goal of Critical Mass. We are Traffic! Let's continue to ride into the car traffic.
Thank you PC, your with never ceases to be sharp. And yes, they can contribute on the internet, but you know what's even better way to contribute? Do it for reals. In the Real World.
Like a lot of people on rides, I'm not really on this site all that much. I happened to be near a computer today, so I am right now, but that's just right now.
As for numbers, well, no not really, but a critical mass isn't all that Critical or a mass when it dwindles to say 20 people, in a place like los angeles.
I also wanted to say, as someone mentioned earlier, about the whole critical mass isn't supposed to have rules, it doesn't. there's no rule that what has been going on in LA is RIGHT or WRONG, but it does WORK. The ride stays pretty good sized for a long while into the night, and as someone somewhere above said, the original idea of critical mass was to improve bicycle visibility on the streets, by being on the streets. A ride that stays together and rides longer is going to do that.
Another facet of riding, particularly in a city like Los Angeles, has become the fact that it IS an alternative social space. That is what happens both ON our bikes and OFF of them. This merging of two of the most important social re-imaginings of the 1990's (Critical Mass and Reclaim the Streets!) could be one of the greatest factors of the cycling community in LA at present. Sure we "stand around in parking lots" we also Dance in them and Jump Rope, and Play, and Do what we want! This re-imagined use of public/publicly available space is important. Yes critical mass started with one intent, however, here we are 16 years later, with different circumstances, both physically, and culturally, in a different city. Maybe being flexible, adapting to the environment around us and working with it is a more important way of working with a ride or an idea than trying to do it "the critical mass way", of which there is no real such thing. There is a San Francisco way of doing critical mass, and that's their thing. There's also a NY style, a Boston Style, a Chicago style, a Wichita version, and a Sarasota, Florida version, and other ways in every other city across the world.
There is no "correct" "by the book" way to do a critical mass. it is done in MANY ways, every city has variations.
I really really hate to shatter anybody's illusions, but...honestly, for some folks, hanging around in parking lots just gets old after a while. Yes, even with the jump ropes. Yes, even with the delusional self-congratulatory dreck about re-imagining public space (a legitimate idea, to be sure, but one which presupposes an experience that is actually less lame than hanging around in some douchey club).
Seriously, I'm not trying to hurt anybody's feelings here, but how long are we going to keep patting ourselves on the back for discovering that it's possible to drink in parking lots on a Friday night? Generations of bored teenagers and homeless alcoholics have made the same discovery, mainly because they don't have anywhere else to go. We do have other places to go, and we have bikes to get us there, so what the fuck are we standing around for?
then... where else are we going to go? we do need to stop somewhere.
And well, some people like to drink when they stop, and that's good for them. there are also ridazz who DON'T do any sort of intoxicant. yet they seem to keep coming, and don't tell me it's all for the ride part. if it was about the riding only, then Wolfpack would be the largest ride in the city.
Sure some times just hanging around can get boring, well, if it does then come up with something else.
Naysaying does no good.
Pointing out a problem (especially repeatedly), while helpful does nothing to solve it.
Actively contributing to a solution, or attempting at least to find one, will only get you closer to finding a better solution to a problem.
Oh, and I'd rather hang out in a parking lot with a large number of people many of whom I know, many I've only just met, and others who I may never see again, but are still experiencing a greater form of community, use of space, and for many self expression, than ANY club could offer.
Plus it's free...
and well... ass rev phil said...
don't like it, do it better!*
*doing it better means doing.... not just talking about it.
Yes CM should be about large numbers in the street, but it doesn't have to be. Using Wiki as my reference, it states in part, "In order for the event to function, the only requirement is a sufficient turn-out to create a "critical mass" of riders dense enough to occupy a piece of road to the exclusion of drivers of motorized vehicles, pedestrians, and other road users."
When did you move to SoCal? So what you are saying is that if we did the traditional CM, the ride will breakup after 10 miles, but if we rode the CM as it is laid out now, and then go to the people's ride, we can ride all night long? I like the solution you and others have laid out, if you don't like it, change it at the front of the pack. In other words it's have your goons see our goons, and may the best goons win!
No one is arguing that there shouldn't be stops during the night, but I have confidence that the ridazz can ride more than 4 miles before needing to take a break. Having a stop after 10 miles or so used to be the style. We've gotten away from that. Not having leaders is another thing we've gotten away from. And most importantly, we gotten away from having the city open to us for riding. It's become where CM rolls in a roughly 5 mile radius.
We've taken the initiative to do something better. We'll offer everyone a fair chance to vote equally, with no leaders. Our agenda will be made by general consensus. Based on an outline followed by just about CMs in the world. That would be that it's leaderless, route less, and no set time of completion or arrival point.
@everyone else, yeah we get it! It's drama, don't wish you had some in your lives?
I've been in CA for several years and been riding the whole time, and I've been a lot of other places too.
I wasnt saying that it should be a group of "goons" I was saying that one needs to get enough interest to sway the pack from whatever trajectory it is taking. Those "goons" could be the same people guiding the ride one way, or it could be a number of different people. It doesnt matter.
There are many, many different ways to organize a Critical mass, read the structure part in the article you linked. The same thing I've been saying all night. The other thing I've been trying to say is, if we want to maintain a "critical mass" we have to make concessions to LA's structure as a sprawling megalopolis. The nature of our city's decentralized system (unlike many older or physically constrained cities) makes it difficult to maintain a mass when it begins to splinter.
Annie, what attempts? just asking, the only attempt I can think of was barleye telling me he didnt want to go to a liquor store.
I wasnt the only one with a megaphone, and I certaintly wasnt the only one with vocal chords.
I didnt see anyone attempt to take the ride out of any of the places we stopped. Or anyone even go to the front and start calling for a turn, other than people who had decided on going to the places we ended up.
In my experiences with rides, it's pretty easy to hijack one, and to be honest, critical mass is pretty easy as rides go to get it to turn. Just start yelling a turn near enough to the front to make it happen, people will go.
A modest proposal: stop at more lights, at less liqour/grocery/convenience stores.
02.2.09 - 2:23 am
i was going to mention this because you, tallcansfortallbikes, and i did this for the VeGaN BaNaNa PeNiS ride and we were very successful and keeping everyone together as a huge group and not dropping folks. it was great! i didn't mention it because that was an MR ride.
By the way, so what if people start peeling off at 8:30 or so? By that time rush hour is long past, and CM has pretty much made its point. After that, if people still want to ride and have adventures, fine. If they have other things to do (it's Friday night after all), fine. Hard as it may be for some of us to believe, not everybody with a bicycle lives his or her life around the bike scene.
regarding beer stops. In the past, us beer drinkers would get a 12pack before the ride at the Rite Aid or CVS around the corner. We would eventually stop around the 45 minute or 1.5 hour mark. People would get refreshments or use the bathrooms or whatever, we would just not bee line to the liquor store. We would never wait for anybody in the past and that would be fun in its own way when you had to try to find the ride. Most of the time you could find it. If you had a flat, most of the times that when you made new friends. The people that would stop and help you. MEMORIES
The goons I was referring to was you, Drooby, SKD, and Stillline. You like refer to it as the "group". I refer to it as the leaders or the goons in charge. To make any change in direction one has to confront the goons. So they need to come with a bigger more vocal goon squad in order to initiate change. That's not the way CM should work. We'll see that that isn't the case with the 7pm group.
Some will see it as a fresh approach cause they haven't been around that long. In reality it's getting back to what makes CM CM, and away from just another MR ride.
I think you've been coming to the LACM rides for about two years if I'm not mistaken right? Do you have a fav CM in LA?
flats...that was the first time i met you, dingo, and louis.....on a sins ride near the citadel...Charlie's wife had a flat and i stopped to hang with you guys...you kept calling me a hipster cuz i had the dead end ride card in my spokes.......
@ User1, if you want to label me a goon, that is your choice. I don't determine the route, people come and tell me where the route is going. Why? Because I ride in the middle or the back of the pack (the other night I rode for a short time with Matt). I help the stragglers and the weaker riders keep up and remain part of the group. If you came to every CM you would know this. I never ride in the front. I never lead the group.
@meandmybluebike, Annie. I love and miss you. Your opinion is important and we miss your participation in rides. I wish you would come to more of the rides. I know you are like us, you want a cohesive and vibrant bicycle community.
@everybody, pick up your trash! We still leave too much trash at the stops.
Ok, this is my first and last post for the day. I can't hang on the forums like you hippies. I have to work.
Funanu i didnt see u at this ride it aint sad it is awesum! People dont let CRANK MOB infect classic ride stuctures. Get all yer beer first, put it in your hipster purse, and drink it WHILE you ride, what a concept. FUCK predicating a ride on stops. RAISE HELL in Hollywood, Beverly Hills, and wherever there are tons of people and cars to disrupt, this is the real message of Critical Mass! I am tired of people who think they are so OG but dont know shit about bike culture.
The last LACM I went to was 3 months ago. It had the same exact route. Certian areas are badass, ie Hollywood and Highland etc. but lets change how we get there and actually ride!
yeah this was the first time i missed a LACM since sept of 07. i just hate how we do the samething over and over. we hit the same liquor/market stops. and I hate that LACM only goes for about 2 hours and bam we go to the people ride. I love LACM when I first started going in 07. blah.
I started riding LACM when it started at Sunset and Parkman. There it never started any later than 7pm. Then people wanted to move it to Wilshire and Western to accommodate ridazz from the Westside and be a little more central to LA. I liked that it was at a metro station finally. It has started at various times from 6pm to 730. People's ride is maybe a year old.
I also loved the rides that went to 1-2 in the morning. For some reason they stick in my head as being the funniest.