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Thread Box:
Any mountain bikers?
Thread started by Team Creanberry at 05.14.09 - 11:04 pm

Since my other bike is a horse, I've been hearing a lot of rumblings in the area I board my horse (near Hansen Dam) of political action to remove mountain bikes from most if not all trails in the area. I've been vaguely indifferent to all of this so far, since I've neither had bad encounters with cyclists (though I know riders who've almost been killed), nor seen the cyclists treated as villains until now. I just read this idiotic rambling in which the horse bitch feels the need to bring up city bike lanes for "transportation bikers" (WTF? What does that even have to do with horses?) . . . http://socalequine.com/press_release.htm#41309

I feel conflicted.

reply


Eeergh.. I find the info at that link disturbing.

The form-letter for people to request bike prohibition....

The author mentions city parks where bikes should be banned including Verdugo which is a very bike friendly park.

I have shared trails with horse rider for decades and NEVER had an incident.
I have fun and when I see a horse or a hiker, I yield the trail.
Just look at the sign.. it works fine.





adamthelizard
05.14.09 - 11:27 pm

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I've never personally had a serious incident with a cyclist, but I know plenty of riders who have (one said a cyclist sped down the trail, scaring the bejeezus out of her horse who then went off the side of the trail, rolling over the rider a few times and then getting them both stuck in a ditch. It's a miracle they both survived. The cyclist never stopped). My big wish is that cyclists would not only slow/stop their bikes, but make eye contact with the rider and ask what the rider needs, as the cyclist doesn't know the horse and probably can't read horse behavior, and should take cues from the rider, rather than decide that things "look OK" and keep going.

However, I don't have nearly as big a beef with cyclists as I do with unleashed dogs.

Oh yeah, and I'm also really bothered that the idiot horse bitch on that site talked about trail riding being relaxing. I usually tear down the trail on my horse (though not around blind corners, and I immediately slow to a walk as soon as I see another horse/pedestrian/whatever).



Team Creanberry
05.14.09 - 11:39 pm

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HUGE +1 on the off-leash dog thing..
I've even been chased by people's dogs.

You sound like a very reasonable trail user.. like most.

I wish people would realize it's not the method of transit that causes problems, it's the user's/rider's attitude and awareness.

Personally, I'm very very cautious around horses.
I don't wanna get kicked!






adamthelizard
05.15.09 - 8:19 am

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Ive been chased by dogs before and one time i almost landed on some ladies chihuawas of a huge jump she was like 25 feet away ! SHe started yelling at me so i simply said my apologies but leash law and next time he is going to be done! Check out this pic! This would have been her pooch!



pporras
05.15.09 - 10:21 am

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There was this one time i was riding through PV and saw a girl (16ish) riding a horse on the bridal trail while texting on her cell phone.... i lol'd a bit...



e-rock
05.15.09 - 12:02 pm

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Guys I wanna go trail riding!

I have a MTB who has never seen a trail and he tells me his life feels unfulfilled!



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 1:41 pm

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im going up to mnt lowe tommorow! have you ever ridden tech sections before?



pporras
05.15.09 - 2:29 pm

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No, I haven't done any of the riding that my MTB is made for!

I can't ride tomorrow because I am already doing my own predawn ride (It's for my sanity) tomorrow, but I'd love to hit some trails or something to learn the ropes.



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 3:29 pm

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And as far as the MTB vs horse thing goes...my sister rides horses and I used to be scurred of them, but then I met her horse and he was so sweet! And I guess I must just have an interest in alternate forms of transportation because now I want to ride the horse!

Anyway, I think that at the place where you board you should try to explain to folks that not everyone is like that. That we have to work together to get along, and that MTB are enjoying the trails the same way riders are (I'm assuming, since for me it would be a pleasant escape from the city). And that if they catch a naughty MTB, they should maybe try to educate them instead of get mad.

It's amazing what can happen if people talk instead of just fume.

I understand the concern, it's the same when you're on a bike! And I've ridden a horse before and I know it's not that easy! I totally respect horses.



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 3:46 pm

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come with us tuesday! we meet at the JPL parking lot every tuesday at 6pm sharp and climb up to lower brown and come down the el prieto trail! This is such a popular trail and is great for begginers! it last about 1 hour 30 mins! usually about 15-25 of us ! Feel free to join us!



pporras
05.15.09 - 4:47 pm

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Okay!

When do you guys usually end? I have a shitty work schedule (Gotta be there by 6am), but I don't mind being a little tired. Also, can I take the Metro there?

I have both knobby and hybrid tires (Slick in the center, knobby on the outside) - which would be better?

What else should I come prepared with?

Y'all won't mind a total newb ridin with ya?



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 5:15 pm

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The only solution is too ban horses from all public lands. As a hiker I've had way more horrible encounters with equestrians than I have with mtn bikers. Anything from equestrians in control but running their horses around blind corners in Griffith Park to absolutely out of control horses many times over the years.

Or at the very least every equestrian AND horse should be licensed and approved before they're allowed on public trails. At least with mtn bikers were dealing with human beings who just might have a brains. Over the years I've found it hard to believe that horses have brains.



toweliesbong
05.15.09 - 5:24 pm

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Yea, a horse is WAY more dangerous than a bike.

@HappyLand: I'm not sure El Prieto is a great first mtb ride.

Pporas has never been on a Mountaineerzz, but his bike is serious downhill gear.. not your average trail bicycle..

We're going to post a May ride of the 'eerzz that will be "the geriatric ride" or something like that.. Both twowheelsgood and I are recovering from injuries, so we're gonna do a chill-paced ride. The start will be somewhere very near Hollywood.. most likely Fairfax+Sunset. Stay tuned, or shoot me an email and I'll try to offer more details.



adamthelizard
05.15.09 - 6:48 pm

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Saying that horses should not be on trails is like saying that bikes shouldn't be on streets. That's shitty. Equestrians on trails are facing the same issues that bicycles on streets are; they're at the mercy of another group of users. Only, imagine that your bike was a 1,000lb+ animal that could kill you or someone else in a heartbeat, with or without meaning to, and had a mind of its own . . . 'cause that's the mindframe that the equestrians are coming from. It's just fascinating to me, with this whole bikes vs. horses issue, to see the CYCLISTS become the big bad fatal accident-causing vehicle, when I'm familiar enough with the bikes vs. cars issue.

Maybe I'm being awfully naive and idealistic, but I'd like to imagine that it's possible for cyclists and equestrians to coexist, and for one group to not feel more entitled to the trails than the other.

And if any a**holes think it's OK to speed past horses, or around blind corners, please keep in mind what horses are capable of, even in the hands of an experienced horseman. An example:



(And in this video, it is nothing short of an act of god that this wasn't worse.)

As far as the craziness in Griffith Park, I've never ridden there but I know there's a lot of rental stables, so of course any yahoo with $50, cowboy dreams, and delusions of riding ability might be out there along with decent horsepeople. Just 'cause they can kick or hit the horse into a canter and hang on doesn't qualify them as "riders."



Team Creanberry
05.15.09 - 6:52 pm

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That's alarming that people can just like "rent" a horse and hop on a trail. I've always been taught that horses and riding should be treated with a lot more respect than that.



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 8:14 pm

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@adamthelizard

Hmmm...well, I might just be emailing you sometime soon.

I would really really like to hit a trail one day very soon!



HappyLand
05.15.09 - 8:15 pm

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@HappyLand - not only are the people on rental horses a safety hazard to themselves, others, and their horses . . . even if they don't kill someone, they make the horses miserable. These horses are more often than not ridden in badly fitted saddles, with harsh bits suitable only for advanced riders who understand their mechanics, purpose, and proper usage, and kicked and yanked around, and generally hurt/confused by beginners until they're ghosts of their former selves. Even when guides go out with them, rental horses still depress the hell out of me. Besides, just because you have a guide doesn't mean s/he knows anything, or even speaks English.

I'll get off my soapbox about that now.



Team Creanberry
05.15.09 - 8:39 pm

reply


No, that's seriously sad that horses get that kind of treatment.

I'm cool with horses on the trails.. like I said, the sign works.
I see a horse (or a hiker) and I stop to let them pass.

People can be responsible, or otherwise, with most things.



adamthelizard
05.15.09 - 8:50 pm

reply


A ban will never work. So don't worry about it. Most people (all people) be they a hiker, biker, or horse rider will have a few people with nothing better to do than try and control the trails for their own personal use, the rest tend to be fine.

And let's say that they "ban" cyclists. Ha. How will they enforce it? There are less than a dozen active park rangers for most of the parks in the greater LA area. Enforcing such a law would not be possible. Perhaps taking one unbalanced persons view and thinking they speak for all people from that group is not the best idea.

I MTB all I can and am willing to go ride with people if they want. I ride two or three times a week in the Valley, where the best trails are at!

Paul
Atomic Cycles.



rev106
05.16.09 - 10:12 am

reply


It's ridiculous that the people doing the least accessible, most expensive, most space-occupying, most trail damaging, probably most dangerous, and definitely smelliest use of trails are trying to ban anyone else!

But they're the richest, so they have a big say.

@ Happyland: I ride lots. Mostly in the Mountains north of Altadena, so from downtown you can take the gold line to Pasadena and then ride to the trails from there. I'd be happy to show anyone El Prieto, it's a good introduction to real mtb trails.

Also, with all respect, Paul is wrong. The best riding around here is in the San Gabes, not the valley.



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by rev106
05.20.09 - 9:29 am

reply


Oh yeah, and I'm also really bothered that the idiot horse bitch on that site talked about trail riding being relaxing. I usually tear down the trail on my horse


this is sarcasm, right? this has got to be sarcasm...







la duderina
responding to a comment by Team Creanberry
05.20.09 - 10:52 am

reply


Lindsay, you still haven't come on mountaineerzz!

I guess you don't have time to fix that before you skip town?



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by la duderina
05.20.09 - 11:05 am

reply


You have better trails than the backbone? Somehow I doubt it.



rev106
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.22.09 - 6:50 am

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best trails around = Angeles Forest... imho

there's a shiton of good riding tho.. no matter who's right..



adamthelizard
05.22.09 - 8:22 am

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I knooowwww!

my god though...the other day I took my beater bike riding around the trails at my parents house...I don't know if I'll be able to keep up! I gotta get my skills back!



la duderina
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.22.09 - 9:31 am

reply


The backbone is a fun little ride and all, but it just ain't nothin like upper sam merrill, the mt. wilson/little santa anita, trail canyon, strawberry peak,.... too many to list.

There are trails up there that take you not simply down the hill, but to a higher plane of existence.



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by rev106
05.23.09 - 3:12 am

reply


Dang, ride in Argentina if you can. Aren't you planning on racing next year?



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by la duderina
05.23.09 - 3:14 am

reply


Perhaps you're ready for the next level. The coaster brake level. We'll be doing a new coaster brake challenge in July, join us if you have what it takes.

www.atomiccycles.com





rev106
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.23.09 - 6:41 am

reply


What about the fact that Horses shit all over the trail ?

Horse owners should be required to carry a bag like dog owners , and clean up there shit



Dedicated818
05.23.09 - 8:54 am

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I'm definitely ready. I did one race the last time (I had a red KHS). It was rockin'.


Are YOU ready???



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by rev106
05.23.09 - 9:32 am

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Sure I'm ready. Ready to throw up from over exertion. Can't wait.




rev106
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.23.09 - 10:11 am

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In October...I've been hitting the track up. Surprising how quickly it all comes back to you...



la duderina
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.23.09 - 11:05 am

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Dang, I might have to rig up a coaster-braked dirt-bike for that shit.. looks really fun.

I did lower and upper Sam Meril yesterday with twowheelsgood and it truly is an elevation to a whole other plane of existence.. cosmic.



adamthelizard
responding to a comment by rev106
05.25.09 - 11:18 am

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adam: dang, I was on those trails yesterday too. Let me know when you come out here next time.



zombiefiesta
responding to a comment by adamthelizard
05.25.09 - 12:30 pm

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Sorry John.
Will do next time.
It was Richard and me and we were at rehab-speed.
Might have been too slow for you anyway.
But I'm getting back towards full speed.
75 or 80 percent now, at least.





adamthelizard
responding to a comment by zombiefiesta
05.25.09 - 4:21 pm

reply


did you see the write up in BIKE?



rev106
responding to a comment by adamthelizard
05.28.09 - 7:18 am

reply


here's a bigger more readable version.

http://www.atomiccycles.com/bikemag.htm





rev106
05.28.09 - 7:21 am

reply


Awesome!



adamthelizard
responding to a comment by rev106
05.28.09 - 8:41 am

reply


here's the current coaster brake info:

http://www.atomiccycles.com/coaster.html



rev106
responding to a comment by adamthelizard
05.28.09 - 9:12 am

reply


Hey mountain riders, just FYI, this is a ride I've been doing off and on for the past couple years. Would love to see some new faces. But can't stress enough, no newbies with headlamps. Be an intermediate mtn rider and have a real night-riding light. Otherwise, the more the merrier!!

LA Westside Wednesday night ride

Break up your week and add more mileage riding the Santa Monicas on Wednesdays at 8:00 pm in West Los Angeles. A small group of regulars meets in the parking lot of Cynergy Cycles on 25th and Santa Monica Blvd. around 7:45 PM, rolling out on the hour. Itís not always the same mix of riders, but the ride is always on, unless itís a special holiday week, etc. We sometimes ride from the shop, but we often drive up to the handful of trailheads nearby. Rides are almost exclusively in the nearby Santa Monicas but sometimes elsewhere (like a rare Chesboro jaunt). Most are usually decided on the spot at 8:00 and involve 1.5 to 2.5 hour variations of the nearby Sullivan Canyon, Sullivan Ridge, Westridge, Farmers/Cliffside, Hectic/Cookies, Will Rogers/Backbone, and sometimes into the Malibu trails. Ride is cross-country, quick pace (but not too fast), sometimes technical on the downhills and thereís regrouping and short breaks as needed. Sorry, NO beginners please. Just bring a decently maintained mountain bike, tire-changing kit and a good riding light/s (A MUST). And optionalÖ.we usually have a beer or two at a dive-bar near the Santa Monica meeting spot after the ride. All are welcome for that too. Feel free to email me....jbroehl at yahoo dott comm



0gravity
05.28.09 - 11:59 am

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I'm down to do some 6-10 am rides in the SFV if anyone is down...

Some good trails out here, yep.





rev106
responding to a comment by 0gravity
06.24.09 - 10:46 pm

reply


HA! I read a similar article in MTB Action. Good Stuff!



Stonerock
responding to a comment by rev106
06.25.09 - 6:30 pm

reply


Horses and MTBers, same old conflict. Problem is education needs to happen on both sides. As a long time MTBer, I've learned the etiquette of sharing the trails as absurb as some are.

Did you know that you've have to dismount your bike, greet the rider, if you meet an equestrian on the trail? If passing a equestrian call out to the to see if its OK to pass and do not follow too closely, it can hurt. Problem is there are protocols and many riders don't take the time to learn them.

Same is true for equestrians, they have money and have this sense of entitlement. Many live in the areas trails are found and also have that sense of ownership. I've live in an equestrian neighborhood and hear my neighbors views all the time. Some even think that I know all MTBers and go out of their way to tell me about their close calls.

It all comes down to common courtesy. Remember the horse's reaction is a big unknown, only the rider can tell you that. Slow down and talk to the equestrians as you pass, it goes a long way towards trail sharing.






sc_nomad
06.25.09 - 7:45 pm

reply

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