LACM STFU
Thread started by
Roadblock at 11.23.10 - 10:05 am
Complaining about the cops is useless. They
don't care. Make a new ride, ride like a parade, play ride and seek, or ride legal or just ride or maybe ride your bicycle. One of those things will solve this situation.
reply
They "they" should admit it instead of pretending to care on here.
But like the LOL WTF rides, I think it would so dope to combine LACM with STFU.
Then I'll ride.
md211.23.10 - 10:11 am
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Done. But I'm not talking about it here.
Joe Borfo11.23.10 - 10:23 am
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They "they" They should stop hating on the popo. Cops have feelings too.
go on stilllines ride.........
Foldie responding to a
comment by md2
11.23.10 - 10:31 am
reply
I think OPENING THE FUCK UP is part of the learning process.
That said ... I think its time to blow LACM open to a city wide ride.
By my count SF is 10x the size of LA so we should have 10x as many masses.
Anybody down to start a shadow mass on the east side.
Or maybe fuck off all this youthful "exuberence" and start an Old Mass for "old people" over 30 and young people with old souls.
Teenangers with boners can have the "old" LACM.
I won't boycott LACM unless there is alternate ride to go to.
LACM is Los Angeles not Wilshire and Western.
trickmilla11.23.10 - 10:41 am
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There is an alternate.. pay attention.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by trickmilla
11.23.10 - 10:42 am
reply
Eventually the 2000 mass will be split
into 4 rides of 500.
Roadblock11.23.10 - 10:57 am
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Cops have feelings too
yeah, but batons don't, so I can see why it's so easy, you know?
Look, if Krumer and other popos really support LACM and the movement, then they dont need to be on assignment to do so. They can join the rides.
In my opinion the LAPD just doesn't (ever) want to take the progressive steps to really support something. Too much politics, too many egos, and too many years of power tripping to work through. Plus they lack the ability and largely the will to reconcile past injustices.
The good cops should just become on of "us" so to speak and stop trying to work from the status as an employee of the LAPD. Doctors, lawyers and such dont ride as doctors, lawyers and such, but we have lawyers who use their external roles to help the movement.
Maybe Krumer and others can take note from that approach. If that makes sense.
Thats my overall position.
Im digging LACMSTFU
md2 responding to a
comment by Foldie
11.23.10 - 11:04 am
reply
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by md2
11.23.10 - 11:10 am
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You can't ever expect the cops to join in any kind of mass of people unless the voters support it. 2000 people on bicycles seems large... But 200,000 people in cars are on the roads that day.
Roadblock responding to a
comment by md2
11.23.10 - 11:10 am
reply
we have lost focused on CM.... CM is not here to change police tactics, enforcement, and or other police issues... if it happens as a by product...great...
CM is suppose to change or get to communities that cyclists have rights and that cycling in Los Angeles is possible, so join us...
CM is suppose to overcome obstacles, laws, police enforcement, negative attitudes... and turn half of those 200k drivers into cyclists.... or get those 200K drivers to understand cycling rights....
dayone11.23.10 - 11:25 am
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In order to be making that happen successfully, we need to be following all the rules.
Stay tuned for how this will be implemented on Friday. You may want to be a part of this.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by dayone
11.23.10 - 11:29 am
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I got this secret trail Im going to take you on for a ride. Not even the police will find you, even if we could get them to start looking.
md2 responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 11:33 am
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http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/event.php?eid=169918173027666
u guys can join here :)
LACMsux11.23.10 - 11:47 am
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lol seems u are leading it xD
LACMsux responding to a
comment by Adrian_The_BEAST
11.23.10 - 11:56 am
reply
That's a different branch than the one we are part of.
Hang in there. info is coming soon.
This effort should be momentous!
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by dayone
11.23.10 - 11:59 am
reply
nah it's cool... i will keep missing events....
dayone responding to a
comment by LACMsux
11.23.10 - 12:04 pm
reply
OKAY the "shadow mass" location start I'm referring to will be announced by word of mouth.
The point is for us all to meet at the chosen destination and also to follow the rules of the road to the T. I mean annoyingly so. Stop at every red light. Only inhabit the right lane. Ride like a NERD. Seriously. The overall objective will succeed if we do this.
Stay tuned because perhaps somebody else will announce it, but I'm not going to do it because none of you listen to me.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by trickmilla
11.23.10 - 12:15 pm
reply
I thought that is the same definition of Critical Mass?
revolution11.23.10 - 1:54 pm
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It will be a better critical mass in definition. Details to be announced shortly.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by revolution
11.23.10 - 2:04 pm
reply
that panda is the best borfo.
et responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 2:49 pm
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Thanks.
No, I really want people to try something different. it can still be like critical mass, I would like us to collaborate to try a new approach.
Many respected ridazz will be posting the details soon. I think that this can really make critical mass amazing and also keep the cops focused on other things rather than our ride.
It takes a little willpower and communication on all our parts, but this is what i'm striving for.
Almost there ...
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by et
11.23.10 - 2:53 pm
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Can't wait to see the final product of the collective effort.
July responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 3:02 pm
reply
"Many respected ridazz will be posting the details soon"
Ridazz are not respected.(in general)
revolution responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 3:04 pm
reply
Perhaps... I'm hoping you and others are willing to change that image.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by revolution
11.23.10 - 3:09 pm
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i would join this ride but i don't know if you will be okay since i do not have gears.... I'M JUST MESSING WITH YOU....
also can't wait to witness the development of people's work....
dayone responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 3:25 pm
reply
I may be building this up quite a bit..
It might not even work...
I am just trying to encourage us to be open minded and experiment with new ideas.
Thanks.
Joe Borfo11.23.10 - 3:34 pm
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Vote Joe Borfo for LAPD/Cyclist relations...Out with Krumer, in with Borfo
revolution11.23.10 - 4:04 pm
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talk about yapping... jeez... get on with it already.
md2 responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 4:06 pm
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hehehe ... aw, don't get all sore buddy.
Stilline says hes posting it tomorrow night.
Thanks for waiting!
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by md2
11.23.10 - 4:14 pm
reply
you really want to play snarky, eh?
I don't care about the damn cops. My intention is to avoid them.... Nevermind, you're hopeless. Go and do your stupid circle of death and fuck up our image.
I'm out of here.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by revolution
11.23.10 - 4:16 pm
reply
Out with PC, in with revolution.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by revolution
11.23.10 - 4:21 pm
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damn. why do i so feel like saying i told you so.
indigis responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 4:24 pm
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borfo, pls keep me in the loop. i wanna go for a ride.
indigis responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.23.10 - 4:25 pm
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this sounds awsome!! I hope u take all the leaders with u to!
pleazzzzz!!!!!
fixie4life11.23.10 - 7:40 pm
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The objective is a dynamic ride that gets to a destination randomly and in multiple groups while respecting the road rules annoyingly well.
Anyone wanting to fuck up our ride gets their tires slashed.
Joe Borfo11.24.10 - 10:55 am
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what are you guys a bunch of Puritans now? Can we still think nasty thoughts while on your ride?
md2 responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.24.10 - 11:17 am
reply
Make it happen. Post it on the RIGHT ==>
I see there are already TWO LACM rides posted there, might as well make a third. Call it LACM 2.0. Call it the NEW LACM. Call it ALT.LACM. Whatever, do it.
But don't try and "fix" LACM, that's like trying to fix the Colorado river, it might be possible but is it worth it?
Make something new, and if it's good, maybe LACM will die. And when the old LACM dies, the new one will just be known as "the" LACM.
Now that the People's Ride is dead, I wish there was a People's Ride.
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.24.10 - 11:21 am
reply
You can be as dirty as you want, baby. I'm just talking about dicks telling me I can't make a ride like this happen. I'm talking about people who show up and try to thwart our efforts of demonstrating that WE ARE TRAFFIC and demonstrating that by riding correctly as traffic does.
Our ride. Is a positive new direction.
I'd like to call it the Future of Critical Mass.
If you don't like it, go ride with your homey with no brakes or lights on the wrong side of the street.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by md2
11.24.10 - 11:23 am
reply
Why are you telling me to do something that I am already trying to do?
The Future of Critical Mass is going to happen.
Stay on target...
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by the reverend dak
11.24.10 - 11:27 am
reply
Just do your damn job and post the ride. This is worse than an elimination episode of American Idol.
md2, out!
md2 responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.24.10 - 11:31 am
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I actually don't want to post the ride. I am in the belief that the DIY nature of critical mass can still live within this new direction.
I'd like this to be our ride. This is a big reflection on LA. Let's show them what LA really can be. Someone else will post it soon...
I know there's a few of you that support this.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by md2
11.24.10 - 11:49 am
reply
You know Im messing wit chu, Joesph Borfolomew.
md2 responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.24.10 - 12:09 pm
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Keep repeating that mantra: "Stay on Target"
Look, if we follow CVC, and make sure we "Mass Up" so the back of the ride isn't getting blown apart, then we will win.
And by win I mean:
1. No one will get tickets or be arrested
2. everyone will have fun
3. no rida left behind
4. no one will get hurt
In the meantime, brush up on your CVC or on the Best Practices of CM:
DO
• talk to stranger, bystanders, bus riders, motorists – welcome people to join us next time
• help cars stuck in mass to exit to the right
• stop regularly if you’re in front (no matter how slowly you think you’re going, gaps are opening up behind you)
• stop at red lights when in front to allow the rest of the ride to “mass up” behind.
• keep going in dense packs through red lights to stick together and keep it safe for everyone.
• fill gaps; Critical Mass depends on bicycle density to displace cars.
• remember that pleasure and friendliness are more subversive than anger and blaming.
DON’T
• race ahead to block cross traffic before the Mass has arrived
• ride into oncoming traffic on the wrong side of the road
• pick fights with motorists, even (especially) if they’re itching for one
• fail to turn and twist through the city to make the ride more interesting
• forget to smile and wave and talk to strangers!
• imagine that you are morally superior just cuz you’re on a bicycle (you’ll be in a car again soon enough)
• hesitate to tell other Massers what you think of their behavior, whether good or bad. Talk to each other!
• forget – we are all responsible to make Critical Mass what we want it to be.
alexdc11.24.10 - 12:10 pm
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DONT
• talk to stranger, bystanders, bus riders, motorists – welcome people to join us next time
• help cars stuck in mass to exit to the right
• stop regularly if you’re in front (no matter how slowly you think you’re going, gaps are opening up behind you)
• stop at red lights when in front to allow the rest of the ride to “mass up” behind.
• keep going in dense packs through red lights to stick together and keep it safe for everyone.
• fill gaps; Critical Mass depends on bicycle density to displace cars.
• remember that pleasure and friendliness are more subversive than anger and blaming.
DO
• race ahead to block cross traffic before the Mass has arrived
• ride into oncoming traffic on the wrong side of the road
• pick fights with motorists, even (especially) if they’re itching for one
• fail to turn and twist through the city to make the ride more interesting
• forget to smile and wave and talk to strangers!
• imagine that you are morally superior just cuz you’re on a bicycle (you’ll be in a car again soon enough)
• hesitate to tell other Massers what you think of their behavior, whether good or bad. Talk to each other!
• forget – we are all responsible to make Critical Mass what we want it to be.
LACMsux responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:13 pm
reply
whats wrong with it bowing apart? By that I mean splitting up?
Thats the point now, to create smaller masses given the numbers that attend LACM.
Waiting for the mass to rebuild while following reds would be a nightmare for those in front and middle... everyone
md2 responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:18 pm
reply
good post.
Just know that there will be an Alternate ride happening that I will be a part of that will be embracing these ideals. If you wish to attempt to maintain this on LACM, I wish you all the best.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:20 pm
reply
Perhaps you want to go on the Alternate ride with us in which what you say will be part of the plan.
Join us. Oh wait .. you'll be in SD.
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by md2
11.24.10 - 12:22 pm
reply
I guess no one gets the meaning of STFU....this thread is too long, you're doing it wrong...dot.dong.com
Foldie11.24.10 - 12:26 pm
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I have not heard anyone make a coherent argument that this cannot work.
alexdc11.24.10 - 12:28 pm
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I can't believe this douchebag alexdc, is urging people to talk to strangers when, I saw and heard someone ask for Him at CM in Aug, after HE had suggested people ask for Him to provide them with the necessary info HE said to this kid.."he's not here yet, He must be running late": What a fucking hypocrite!
This guy is one of those who use CM as a tool for whatever the reasons may be.
ericduville11.24.10 - 12:36 pm
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If everyone obeys the laws, the ride will get stretched out. That's all. No one will get tickets, but riding en masse won't happen either. Well, it can. But once you get more than 20 people in a group, it's pretty much impossible to keep them together. Lights are just not long enough for 20 cyclists to go, stop, and go again. If they're already going, then it's more likely some will make a light. The stops are what does it, that's why we cork in the first place, to keep the group together, because we KNOW it is safer that way. But then you'll see the real problems with cars. The cops will get annoyed, and start corking arbitrarily, and ticket randomly because they'll be inconsistent with the corking, and we're back to how it was.
Don't get me wrong, but it's WORTH a shot. Make it happen.
I'll be on the Alternative Ride attempting the same thing, maybe.
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:39 pm
reply
Hi Eric,
I was late to that ride. You're correct. I apologize. I have no excuse, but if you're curious my boss wouldn't let me leave on time.
http://engagedobserver.blogspot.com/2010/09/los-angeles-critical-mass-september.html
As for my "use" of CM, I'm confused. If by use you mean I want there to be more riders in the mass, having fun, staying safe, not getting tickets and growing cycling in Los Angeles, then yes, I am using CM.
The text I posted is not my own words, they come from this website:
http://www.sfcriticalmass.org/2009/10/27/critical-mass-dos-donts/
I really hope to meet you in person on Friday so we can settle any disputes you might have with me personally.
Ride Safe.
alexdc responding to a
comment by ericduville
11.24.10 - 12:44 pm
reply
We shouldn't listen to the cops. We should ride according to CVC. If the front of the ride goes at a slow steady pace, stopping at every light, then the back of the ride can ride at a faster pace, also stopping at every light. It will work if the front maintains their focus and stays on target. If they get a boner and start mashing, it's over.
alexdc responding to a
comment by the reverend dak
11.24.10 - 12:47 pm
reply
If riders get bored riding slowly at the front, they can pull over, enjoy the view of 2000 riders flowing past them for 5 minutes, then hop on the back and mash to the front.
alexdc responding to a
comment by the reverend dak
11.24.10 - 12:49 pm
reply
Alex,
You were the one giving that answer, I may not know all the royalty members personally but I read a lot of blogs and sites on things that catch my interest, bicycle stuff is one of those things and, a lot of these post pictures and if I'm not mistaken you contribute to some and therefore, I know what you look like.
Let's just avoid the backpedaling if at all possible.
Eric.
ericduville responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:54 pm
reply
Please accept my apologies, You are not the Alex I was referring to.
Now I am the douche bag.
ericduville responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 12:58 pm
reply
Let's quit the name calling and hostility.
Regards,
Borfo
Joe Borfo responding to a
comment by ericduville
11.24.10 - 12:59 pm
reply
I've embarrassed myself enough for a day, I am out.
Once again, I'm sorry Alex.
ericduville responding to a
comment by Joe Borfo
11.24.10 - 1:02 pm
reply
I'm definitely not royalty. I'm just a bike freak with a flag!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/20990388@N04/5072227083/in/set-72157625016490079/
alexdc11.24.10 - 1:03 pm
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Yes, we should follow the CVC, when practicable. But in order for 2000 people on bikes to stay together, you will HAVE TO cork. That many people can spread out over a mile, and no way are the lights sync'd enough for that many people on bikes to stay together and follow the lights. Cars can't even do it. Even 100 riders can't even fit between some city lights.
Not saying you shouldn't "try", just saying it's been tried for years. It doesn't work.
In general, most people on these rides want to ride safely and have fun, together.
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 1:21 pm
reply
what if there was a concerted effort to splinter the ride at the front?
tortuga_veloce11.24.10 - 1:25 pm
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back in the day you could ride to the front of the mass and say "hey some folks got caught at a light, lets wait up". It was very chill, easy going, etc.
It's not really like that anymore. I dont attend the various rides, so maybe some still embrace that element.
Trying to do so on LACM seems to be pointless in way. With the amount of riders attending LACM, keeping 2000 riders together WHILE OBEYING REDS, is just turning the phrase "we are traffic" into the negative sense of "traffic".
Having smaller groups (masses) following reds at their own leisure and such would (in my opinion) make for a more easy going ride. Everyone should enjoy the ride, so constantly trying to regroup, regroup, regroup makes it into a needless headache.
I think youre transferring the experience of rides splitting when we "do" cork, to the experience of the ride splitting without corking. If you dont cork, then dont wait for the next 40 people to join, just keep your smaller group in tact and then have your big bang at the destination.
yap yap yap yap yap yap all up in my lap
I'll be cheering on all you revolutionaries and rebels from some dive bar in SD. I promise at least one bar fight or embarrassing moment for my gf during LACM hours.
md2 responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 1:27 pm
reply
What if there was? Posting it on these forums would only compromise such as effort, narc.
If you have a plan, tell your friends. Make it happen. But don't tell everyone about it, or you will get a call from the LAPD telling you to stop interfering with their efforts to control us.
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by tortuga_veloce
11.24.10 - 1:28 pm
reply
keep your eyes fixed on the boob-toob, maybe we'll make headline news!
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by md2
11.24.10 - 1:32 pm
reply
I would argue that even with corking the ride is over a mile long. See my videos of LACM when police assisted and you'll see a static shot that runs over 4 minutes!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jl2-flPLW5c
That said, better communication with the front and rear of the ride could help keep the ride "massed up"
Also, riders at the front could pull over and wait. We can legally park in a parking space and let slower riders catch up.
There endless strategies that follow CVC that we could utilize.
alexdc responding to a
comment by the reverend dak
11.24.10 - 1:46 pm
reply
We all need to have a few simple rules programmed into our heads, then the ride will function smoothly. Some rules are:
ride slow at the front
stop at all reds
pull over and wait if you're at the front and there's gaps in the mass
make turns
Never blame the police, we are all responsible to make Critical Mass what we want it to be, not LAPD.
alexdc11.24.10 - 1:51 pm
reply
Sorry, but no way would 200, much less 2000, people be able to cross an intersection on one light. It's always been the standard practice that the front of the ride hold up on occasion and let the stop lights cycle a few times, for the ride to catch up. It works, to an extent. Communication on MR or other mass rides works, sometimes. But LACM has no organizers, so it's not practical or practicable.
But don't let me discourage you from trying.
the reverend dak responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.24.10 - 1:55 pm
reply
I'm not saying I'm trying to lead the ride one way or another.
I am trying to influence the people who read this forum and care about this ride to think about how we can strategically address the presence of LAPD on our ride within the confines of CVC.
LAPD is not going anywhere. Their strategy is not set. They've experimented and seem to be leaning towards 100% CVC compliance. Assuming that is the case, what's the best strategy for us to maximize our fun while welcoming new riders, being safe and not getting tickets?
alexdc responding to a
comment by the reverend dak
11.24.10 - 2:00 pm
reply
best way to beat the pigs and still have a CM ride is to call out a park or a point in hte city and ride to it. u go the way u want. ther would be ridaz on all the streets! the pigs would mis a lot of us.
fixie4life responding to a
comment by alexdc
11.25.10 - 12:16 am
reply
Don't forget your self defense weapons for when Krumers buddies try to kick the shit out of you.
revolution11.25.10 - 7:44 am
reply
if i can jump in here.......
---------->attention:the soulution to get rid of lapd at critical mass is to not have critical mass anymore in the city of la!!!!!!aint that a big duh.........<------------------
change the meet up to a unicorporated city like per se glendale and lapd will have no juristiction in entering such unincorporated cities....
aint that a no brainer!
steven11.25.10 - 3:32 pm
reply
Glendale is an incorporated city, and Glendale PD is TERRIBLE. Just for future reference.
Ms. Stephanie responding to a
comment by steven
11.25.10 - 9:36 pm
reply
unincorporated as its not part of the city of losangeles.incorporated as it has its own city hall yes.
my emphasis is let take this to a new city and thier pd wont know what hit em.how years and recently months(larger particpation) did it take for lapd to come out and enforce/supervise?!it became a problem beacuse its been the same meeting spot for how many years now?western and wilshire sure is getting boring.....
imagine a new city every month!they will be clueless.most pd department dont even have enforcement on bikes or horses for that matter.
steven11.25.10 - 10:18 pm
reply
my emphasis is let take this to a new city and thier pd wont know what hit em
you haven't been on too many rides I take it. But you're right, the police always do well went hit with surprises.
most pd department dont even have enforcement on bikes or horses for that matter.
yeah, not sure the problem has been with horses or bikes. In fact I think we're all good with bike and horses.
md2 responding to a
comment by steven
11.25.10 - 10:33 pm
reply
ive been on plenty of rides to know that when crossing city limits,next bordering pd is already waiting.in hindsight an interdepartment chase aint good.
my thought of taking a mass ride to a unprepared city would be good but sooner or later these departments would be trained to deal with "bike parades".
i guess my deeper emphasis is that the same ol meeting spot for cm has been played out!!!!!!
steven11.26.10 - 12:14 am
reply
There WILL be efforts at the old start point to do the same exact thing as what I'll be trying to do at the new start point.
This movement towards change is bigger than you think.
And I encourage ALL of you to work together towards this new idea of riding-
Ride any way you choose to get to the chosen destination. (You can ride fast, you can ride slow, you can ride with or without the four groups, but you will ride according to the rules of the road as a demonstration of our ability to do so.)
When this happens. Bikes will be everywhere getting to the same place in a legal fashion.
So jump on your General Lee or put on your or your Daisy Dukes, and let's show Roscoe and Boss Hog they can't put a vise on LA bike rides anymore.
Joe Borfo
11.26.10 - 4:45 am
reply
Ride Safe, Ride Smart and most of all, Have Fun!!!
Ride On!!!
Ninja biker11.26.10 - 7:21 am
reply
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Ridazz Roulette!
