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Thread Box:
why do hit and runs occur?
Thread started by Roadblock at 05.22.09 - 11:33 am

So Dj Wheels was looking up the law on hit and run incidents and as I understand it, hit and runs have degrees of penalties based on how much damage or injury is done to the person or vehicle....

anyway as it turns out, its a far lesser crime in most cases to be charged with a hit and run versus being charged with a drunk driving accident.

Long story short.... I've been told that 90% of hit and runs are drunk drivers who understand the implications of getting caught drunk or getting caught running.

If we want to change the amount of hit and runs that occur then the law has to be changed so that the penalties of a hit and run far outweigh the penalties for a drunk driving accident.

reply


Wow, I'm dumb. I've never thought of it that way. Duh! We're taught that in Elementary School. Getting caught AFTER THE FACT, is always better than getting caught on the scene.

The other way is making the penalty for the DUI be less, for staying on the scene. Kind of a remorse kind of thing. I'm having a hard time explaining. But it's essentially the same thing.



the reverend dak
05.22.09 - 11:38 am

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"Long story short.... I've been told that 90% of hit and runs are drunk drivers who understand the implications of getting caught drunk or getting caught running. "


90% of hit and runs are drunk drivers who have no fucking balls to take responsibility for their actions. Don't give them more credit than they [don't] deserve.



SPOOK
05.22.09 - 12:29 pm

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oops!



SPOOK
05.22.09 - 12:29 pm

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Duty to Stop at Scene of Accident

20001. (a) The driver of a vehicle involved in an accident resulting in injury to a person, other than himself or herself, or in the death of a person shall immediately stop the vehicle at the scene of the accident and shall fulfill the requirements of Sections 20003 and 20004.

(b) (1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), a person who violates subdivision (a) shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison, or in a county jail for not more than one year, or by a fine of not less than one thousand dollars ($1,000) nor more than ten thousand dollars ($10,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine .

(2) If the accident described in subdivision (a) results in death or permanent, serious injury, a person who violates subdivision (a) shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for two, three, or four years, or in a county jail for not less than 90 days nor more than one year, or by a fine of not less than one thousand dollars ($1,000) nor more than ten thousand dollars ($10,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine. However, the court, in the interests of justice and for reasons stated in the record, may reduce or eliminate the minimum imprisonment required by this paragraph.

(3) In imposing the minimum fine required by this subdivision, the court shall take into consideration the defendant's ability to pay the fine and, in the interests of justice and for reasons stated in the record, may reduce the amount of that minimum fine to less than the amount otherwise required by this subdivision.

(c) A person who flees the scene of the crime after committing a violation of Section 191.5 of, or paragraph (1) of subdivision (c) of Section 192 of the Penal Code, upon conviction of any of those sections, in addition and consecutive to the punishment prescribed, shall be punished by an additional term of imprisonment of five years in the state prison. This additional term shall not be imposed unless the allegation is charged in the accusatory pleading and admitted by the defendant or found to be true by the trier of fact. The court shall not strike a finding that brings a person within the provisions of this subdivision or an allegation made pursuant to this subdivision.

(d) As used in this section, "permanent, serious injury" means the loss or permanent impairment of function of a bodily member or organ.

Amended Sec. 1, Ch. 854, Stats. 1999. Effective October 1, 1999.
Amended Sec. 30, Ch. 747, Stats. 2007. Effective January 1, 2008.



DJwheels
05.22.09 - 12:41 pm

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Interesting. Though I tend to agree with Spook - that is a weak sauce punishment for hit and run where DEATH results. WTF?



Alex Thompson
responding to a comment by DJwheels
05.22.09 - 12:44 pm

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In other words:

If someone is INJURED, the penalty is either 1) imprisonment (maximum ONLY of one year) 2) a fine of $1000 to $10,000 or 3) both a fine and imprisonment.

If someone DIES or is SERIOUSLY INJURED, the penalty is either 1) two, three or four years imprisonment 2) or 90 days to 1 year iin county jail or 3) a fine of $1000 - to $10,000 or 3) both a fine and imprisonment.

Oh and by the way...a judge, in the interest of justice and basically a mercy plea by the defendant on the record, can consider eliminating the minimum imprisonment requirement





DJwheels
05.22.09 - 12:50 pm

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CVC 13350 also requires the immediate REVOCATION of a driver's license for failing to comply with CVC 20001.

Failure to report an accident within 10 days of the incident can also get your license suspended.



DJwheels
05.22.09 - 12:59 pm

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I honestly don't mean for this to start some kind of immigration / racial thing but any honest look at why hit and runs occur here has to include a consideration of immigrants here without proper papers, licenses, etc. A not inconsequential percentage of hit-n-runs in LA are drivers fleeing the scene for fear of deportation (kind of a big deal for them).

Itís hard to prove and quantify because the nature of a hit and run is that most of the time you donít know who ran and why because they arenít caught. According to the Pew Hispanic Center and Center for Immigration Studies (legitimate, non-racist think tanks), the seven states with the highest rates of fatal hit-and-run crashes are also the seven states that have the most illegal immigrants.

I'll probably now be accused of being racist. I'm not. Donít shoot the messenger. Just sharing a legitimate consideration.




0gravity
05.22.09 - 1:33 pm

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Samoans, do the Humpty Hump, do the Humpty Hump



the reverend dak
05.22.09 - 2:32 pm

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Maybe they should add an automatic DUI charge on top of the hit & run charge?



mr rollers
05.23.09 - 10:10 am

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How you going to charge someone for a DUI if you don't know they were drunk or not?

Hit and run drivers leave cause they are already in trouble, so what do they have to lose? Nothing really, but they do have alot to gain, or avoid really.

Like was said, make the penalty for running far more severe and you'll cut down on alot of this. Which goes back to what I was suggesting a long time ago. Start advocating increases in penalties rather than trying to introduce new laws.



User1
responding to a comment by mr rollers
05.23.09 - 10:35 am

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RB, this goes hand in hand with my plan for the stop sign law. See thread I am about to post.



la duderina
05.23.09 - 10:41 am

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I am all for that. And it would be easy to get support from law enforcement and from groups like M.A.D.D. Because its such an obvious loophole to the drunk driving laws that are out there.

That hit and run law is weak. It basically allows a judge to not sentence anything even under the worst conditions.





Roadblock
responding to a comment by User1
05.23.09 - 10:43 am

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If i remember when you are in a car accident and you speed away it becomes a felony but I could be wrong



Avis_One
05.23.09 - 10:51 am

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on paper the penalties are very stiff. felony, fine, up to a year in prison or up to 4 if you kill the person, as has been stated above.

but in practice it amounts to a slap on the wrist, because so little can be proven after the fact, so courts end up being lenient, which they shouldn't...



cassidy
responding to a comment by Avis_One
05.23.09 - 10:56 am

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Yes, I know that you can't prove the person was drunk. I guess what I'm really getting at is that the penalty for a hit & run needs to be stiffened so that it is something akin to a DUI plus an additional penalty for the hit & run.

And yes, I'm in favor of giving people driver's licenses regardless of their immigration status - better to get them into the system where they might be able to receive some education and be held accountable.



mr rollers
responding to a comment by User1
05.23.09 - 12:06 pm

reply


In 1996 or so I was stopped in the left-turn lane waiting to turn and my car got rammed almost head-on. Luckily no one was hurt. The driver probably thought she killed my sister and me and fled the scene and a few people not only got her number but gave chase.

Even then I don't think they got a prosecution, because as it turns out I think you need a positive ID from an eyewitness and it's really hard to pick the right person from a lineup or photos because everyone looks similar!

It's way fucked up, but fleeing seems to a good way to avoid prosecution.

And yeah, I would much rather that licenses be open to everyone. If you take them away from people, they will still drive, just under the radar.



cabhauler
05.23.09 - 2:14 pm

reply

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